Which sub(s) work directly on the "Nice Guy" syndrome?


I’m curious what a combination of Ascension and PCC will do not just eliminating nice guy behavior at it’s core but to become confident and powerful in whatever industry or path you choose. I just found my next stack


If you go the ascension route I recently used it for a week only and it made me very assertive almost to the point where it was as if I was looking for a fight. If someone said something in a tone I didn’t like, someone looked at me, someone tried to show dominance over me I would Not back down. I had to watch my mouth because it would have got me in trouble. I experienced something similar when I first joined sub club and chose ascension as my first product. Ascension works very fast btw


That’s interesting.

Have you ever run Regeneration?


I’ve never used regeneration I’ve used khan st1 though


I’ve been running Regeneration a bit to balance Emperor out. I’m still in bed as I woke up feeling shame, wishing to avoid it, but I’ve had these ideas I’ve wanted to share here, so here I am.

I watched half of the Dr. Glover video yesterday, and I ruminated on a single point he brought up. He pointed out that nice guys seem to hang on to a lot more pain than others (rough paraphrase). Something I noticed and have felt shame owning is that I identified myself as a shameful person ages back. I wondered why that is in my life. People get worn out hearing someone stuck in shameful thinking, and this just creates more shame.

For me, the identification was due to shame being the most available and most consistent thing in my life growing up. I had a mom deeply ashamed of herself, no dad, living on welfare, the whole package. I read John Bradshaw’s “Healing the Shame that Binds You” 2 years back, and he used a word which is slipping my mind now, but children just (absorb) their parents’ shame unknowingly. I didn’t even have to do something wrong to feel shame. I owned my mom’s shame since she was my main caretaker. I’ve thought it mine, and my nice guy ruse is primarily a way of me dancing around others so they won’t see this. It creates a lot of hiding, lying to myself, sabotaging female relationships (for me), and yeah, more shame.

It’s a stressor to bring this up and revisit memories while writing, and my desire is for @Fire and @SaintSovereign to see connections here and possibly integrate some counter and reframing measures into future subs.

For me, being honest has helped disempower my shame the most. This is my story.


Attending to the fact that most Nice Guys had bad or inadequate connections with their parents, that would be the very first thing to deal with. I’d dare say that the majority of Nice Guys™ received negligent /abusive parenting.

From inadequate parenting gives rise to toxic shame - the shame of being oneself added to the inherited shame from others.

I’m wholly biased but Regeneration/Elixir would do the most in solving the Nice Guy riddle. Building a skyscraper requires the skeletons to be exhumed first.


To add:

I see the effects of not addressing early parenting everyday with family. The walking wounded looking to others to solve their pain, looking to shiny trinkets to boost their egos, trying to be controlling, “perfect” or “right” in someone else’s mind. It’s sad to see.


I would definitely say yes. However , I’m not using PCC yet. I have been reading @Michel’s journal, and he speaks very highly of it in using it for self protection


PCC + Khan

PCC has extra scripting that links in with Khan, you would definitely succeed in corporate politics.


Definitely the combination of Khan Total Breakdown and Khan St4


Truth. This is scary. I’m so used to trying to say the right thing.

I just got back from doing laundry. I followed up on a plan to look for a microwave at the Goodwill next door, and I did. Having spoken to the cashier already, I asked her if they had a book collection, as most thrift stores usually have one. She pointed me back to a corner I’d not seen.

I found “No More Mr. Nice Guy”, a hardcover. For all of $1.50, and it was new. I hesitated at first, having not run Emp4 in 24 hours. I picked up EOG last night, and have been running it full-time, Stage 1.

I read maybe 15 pages in, and it’s me–all the way.

Fuck. What is said is true. I try to hide my weaknesses for the manipulative reason that “you’ll like me”. Yes, it’s true. Lying has been a habit–and so has me ingraining the belief that I’m a nice guy. I could go on and on and on…since it’s true.

I’m scared shitless airing this now, but it was empowering to read more moment by moment.

Something related to subs and these questionable motivations I’ll share here. I bought EOG last night remembering using another vendor’s money sub, and I felt empowered and increasingly more competent during that time, slowly but surely. I currently have made quite a bit, and I’ve used Emperor for the Mogul piece heavily. I’ve found making decisions with money easy, and after reading @SaintSovereign’s explanation that Mogul could only contain so much as a single stage, I bought EOG via Quadpay.

What I’m questioning with my money is me making big decisions to create a foundation/organization to “help” those in need. Even today, I bought a coworker breakfast, and I felt uncomfortable as I was aware I was waiting on validation, acceptance, and him “needing” me (those all being nice guy motivations). I could beat myself up for this–really I could–but Dr. Glover says not to. I’ve just been using scarcity thinking to get needs met. Self-validation, self belief, self liking–I’ve not had these. So I’ve played others for it day in and day out, all of my life.

This could sound like a self pity monologue. Self pity makes me miserable. Honesty helps me and encourages me. I’m fucking scared I manipulated others in this writing–but fuck NO! I’m tired of being helpless. That self-accusation I say “fuck off!” to.


No More Mr Nice Guy” for $1.50? You did very well :laughing:

Some of the beliefs I deciphered what a nice guy might believe:

  • I see myself as a “good” person
  • My needs and wants don’t matter.
  • Others needs are more important than mine.
  • My existence is for others.
  • I must not be selfish, that’s bad.
  • My mother’s needs supercedes mine.
  • I must please mother so I can get her “love”
  • Everybody is as kind and open as me.
  • I put in the work and expect others to pay me back equal.
  • If someone dislikes me, I must try harder to get them to like me.

Boundaries: - that inwards focus, asking yourself if the environment and other people are “safe” for you feels new to me, and feels kinda feels “selfish”.

Finding my True North

You’re right on every point @Michel. The first one is held dominant in my life, though I’m not aware of all my thinking patterns…yet.

For me, the most selfish and unworkable truth I’ve believed, and read in NMMNG, is that I expect life to be “fine” if I’m good to people (even if I resent them). That people should notice my effort and support me in my journeys. I’m realizing that YES I do believe and act on this. Truthful too is the fact that manipulation can begin immediately if I sense you don’t believe in my sheltered view of life. Oh, and it’s usually subtle, since “nice” guys don’t do things for selfish reasons…cough cough.

I listened to Emp4 most of today, and about an hour ago, I began questioning my beliefs. I believe it’s New Beginnings working. What I realized was that

  1. I’m not sure where it’s taking me, but truth is better than lying, intentional or not, and
  2. I sat there feeling grateful Emperor was digging this up, and not me. Fear and sabotage this would be my avenue…with me feeling both regret and self disgust.
    However, New Beginnings knows right where to go and where to question. I can tolerate pain and find solutions for it if I’m not trying to believe old lies. Without all that bullshit, life works! That is priceless!!

Admission: I considered deleting “bullshit”. I didn’t want to be viewed as flagrant, immature, and without self control. Because people wouldn’t seek me for my wisdom and maturity. :rofl: Because I feel valuable (ummm) if you think I’m a good, wise man of stature.

Cough, cough.

That’s all bullshit I live by.


I would think Ascension and Primal would provide the fastest acting antidote to this.


Any sub that deals with the following:

  • Build Masculinity
  • Develop influence
  • emotionally separate from mother


Anyone know if Khan ST1 addresses this?


Khan ST1 removes everything that’s in the way of the above.


Khan ST1 removes everything that is holding you back to become the man you personally would love to be.

I am 3 months in and I probably continue listening to it until Summer. I am just loving it.

You need to have no internal blockages to really experience the benefits of Khan ST4 to the fullest or you will end up sabotaging your results at one point or another.


Wow, how many hours of listening is that?


@friday I have to agree although with one minor difference. Total Breakdown to me isn’t just about becoming the man you personally want to be but definitely does a lot to uncover the man you really are and so very capable of becoming once all the self sabotaging beliefs and behaviors are eradicated. I’m only 14 days in. I’m more than a little excited and interested to see where I will be when I myself reach the three month mark